Win 10 update

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dilwyn
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by dilwyn »

NormanDunbar wrote: She asked if there was a way to avoid this in future, I installed Linux Mint 19. She took to it like a duck to water! And has never booted into Windows since. The only problem she has is with Zoom. Most times it's fine but occasionally, the sound doesn't work and looks to have changed sources. But it's an easy change to get working.
.
That's not just under Linux, it happens on Windows too. I host meetings over Zoom every week, and hardly anyone gets their audio working first time, the first 15 minutes of most meetings go resolving sound issues. It just seems to forget settings - I've learned to go through the sound test routines (at least Zoom has those) before joining a meeting as it's never the same problem twice. On the whole, if the test audio works beforehand, it generally works during the call. So they all think I'm a miracle worker as my audio always works (if only they knew!)

We refer to the video calls as seances because of the number of "Can you hear me?" "Is anyone there?" etc etc when people try to join


ergonql
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by ergonql »

dilwyn wrote:Finally got it working. Seems one of the recent updates (probably 2020H2) affects ethernet connections. And on systems affected, the fix is not easy.

It had crossed my mind, because the laptop was the only one connected by wifi and the only one which continued to work. I found the old wifi dongles and the PCs work over wifi, the connection then fails again when I revert to ethernet (when I say fails, the the PC can still connect to internet etc, just that PCs on the same private home network can't see each other over ethernet). From what I've read, it's not a simple driver issue, there seems to be a major breakage in windows 10 network discovery from the number of people complaining online, which M$ is not yet admitting to.
I confirm same issue here in Italy, ethernet connections started to break on some PCs since W10 2004 was released, it seems this occurs mainly with PCs upgraded from W7. Reverting to the previous release (1906 if I recall correct) fixed everything but at some point in time support to old versions ends and you are obliged to install the new one. I think I tried most of the fixes suggested on forums etc. most of the time without success. When desperate I use USB3 ethernet interfaces as alternative.


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NormanDunbar
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by NormanDunbar »

Dilwyn wrote:We refer to the video calls as seances because of the number of "Can you hear me?" "Is anyone there?" etc etc when people try to join
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

I spat my (early morning) coffee at that one!

Cheers,
Norm.


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dilwyn
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by dilwyn »

More on the Network Discovery problems, it seems the solution wasn't as easy as I thought (using wifi instead of Ethernet).

As soon as any PC on the home network with any windows update since at least 1909 (possibly earlier, opinions vary) goes to sleep or hibernates (or for any reason goes undiscoverable), that's it, the network is broken again and you have to use Network Reset on all PCs affected. The PC's are not recognised after awakening, I tried, even searching for them. Only seems to "lose" systems running Windows 10. Android, Linux and things like smart speakers aren't affected, they remain discoverable).

Network discovery and file/printer sharing has to be turned off before a Network Reset, then manually turned back on after the Network Reset. After the Reset, Password Protected Sharing is also turned on, so you have to turn that off too. Only realised this after trying to use the network this morning. I can reproduce the problem at will by putting one of the desktop PCs into sleep or hibernation.

So it looks like I'll have to do a Network Reset and restart all undiscoverable PC PC every time I want to share over my home network from now on.

Nice work Microsoft. No wonder people put off upgrading Windows as long as they possibly can. No doubt there'll be another update to fix this and break twenty more things before long.

Imagine having to install the engine on a car halfway through every journey


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Re: Win 10 update

Post by NormanDunbar »

I feel your pain. What a farking nightmare. Imagine if this was a hospital, or similar!


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dilwyn
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by dilwyn »

ergonql wrote:
dilwyn wrote:Finally got it working. Seems one of the recent updates (probably 2020H2) affects ethernet connections. And on systems affected, the fix is not easy.

It had crossed my mind, because the laptop was the only one connected by wifi and the only one which continued to work. I found the old wifi dongles and the PCs work over wifi, the connection then fails again when I revert to ethernet (when I say fails, the the PC can still connect to internet etc, just that PCs on the same private home network can't see each other over ethernet). From what I've read, it's not a simple driver issue, there seems to be a major breakage in windows 10 network discovery from the number of people complaining online, which M$ is not yet admitting to.
I confirm same issue here in Italy, ethernet connections started to break on some PCs since W10 2004 was released, it seems this occurs mainly with PCs upgraded from W7. Reverting to the previous release (1906 if I recall correct) fixed everything but at some point in time support to old versions ends and you are obliged to install the new one. I think I tried most of the fixes suggested on forums etc. most of the time without success. When desperate I use USB3 ethernet interfaces as alternative.
Thanks Davide, this tends to confirm things, although I'd written my answer before I saw your message, sorry.

One of the two desktop PCs used to have Windows 7, the other is a new build PC which never had Windows 7. So looks like the old PC is probably the culprit in that case.


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dilwyn
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by dilwyn »

NormanDunbar wrote:I feel your pain. What a farking nightmare. Imagine if this was a hospital, or similar!
No, Norman !!!
I refuse to go to any hospital run by Windoze!!!

I think these PCs deserve to have Derek let loose on them with his "beat up the PC " avatar!


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Re: Win 10 update

Post by Derek_Stewart »

dilwyn wrote:
NormanDunbar wrote:I feel your pain. What a farking nightmare. Imagine if this was a hospital, or similar!
No, Norman !!!
I refuse to go to any hospital run by Windoze!!!

I think these PCs deserve to have Derek let loose on them with his "beat up the PC " avatar!
Yes you right, too much PC... or Windows is bad for you.

I usually get a Windows PC running correctly and then switch off the Windows Updates and disable the notification.

I have 1 Windows 7 PC running to use Solidworks for 3D modelling and Altium Designer, which good at reverse engineering Gerber files into PCB and Schematic files.

As soon as I can get FreeCad and KiCad to do the same thing, the Windows PC gets changed to Linux.

The best option on a modern PC is Linux Mint 19.3 with Cinnamon Desktop. A really slick system, with available programs on most systems I have used.
Last edited by Derek_Stewart on Thu Mar 07, 2024 9:10 am, edited 1 time in total.


Regards,

Derek
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NormanDunbar
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by NormanDunbar »

derek_stewart wrote:The best option on a modern PC is Linux Mint 19.3 with Cinnamon Desktop. A really slick system, oit pergorms most systems I have used.
Funnily enough Derek, that's exactly my system too. On a 15 plus year old laptop.

Cheers,
Norm.


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ergonql
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Re: Win 10 update

Post by ergonql »

dilwyn wrote:
ergonql wrote:
dilwyn wrote:Finally got it working. Seems one of the recent updates (probably 2020H2) affects ethernet connections. And on systems affected, the fix is not easy.

I confirm same issue here in Italy, ethernet connections started to break on some PCs since W10 2004 was released, it seems this occurs mainly with PCs upgraded from W7. Reverting to the previous release (1906 if I recall correct) fixed everything but at some point in time support to old versions ends and you are obliged to install the new one. I think I tried most of the fixes suggested on forums etc. most of the time without success. When desperate I use USB3 ethernet interfaces as alternative.
Thanks Davide, this tends to confirm things, although I'd written my answer before I saw your message, sorry.

One of the two desktop PCs used to have Windows 7, the other is a new build PC which never had Windows 7. So looks like the old PC is probably the culprit in that case.
On my office PC I ended up keeping it always switched on when I was lucky enough, after some attempts with the network options, to access the company network. Now in general when I switch it on first time it doesn't work, but at next W10 restart in general it works. I think it is ridicolous that a company with a turnover of roughly 150 billion$ does not manage to fix a sw issue reported in hundreds of forums.


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