are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Anything QL Software or Programming Related.
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Cristian
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by Cristian »

Before now, I thought I would never see a music tracker running on a real QL 8-)
It's very promising!
Some comments:
- it crashes with SuperGoldCard (not a problem for me)
- at least one note is out of tune (probably the FA)
- the cursor leaves blue squares on black background (not a real problem indeed)

Please go on with this innovative project. I offer my help, for the little that I am able to do


qbits
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by qbits »

If we are talking about Music trackers which act as music sequencer software for creating musical scores groups of notes. I have thought about extending the QBITS QLSounds BEEP and SCORE modes screen layout to include a more versatile Digital Synthesizer/MIDI Format editor.

Unfortunately, QL Beep Attributes I assume to the best of my knowledge generate a 16bit digital code and used with single transistor as a primitive form of Digital Analogue Conversion to energise the internal speaker. To create a digital coded output 24bit or 32Bit the latter better for MIDI recordings this will require a serial port outputting to a more versatile DAC device.

Note: Zpectrum Next has a Beep command but also enhanced sounds with a Play command deploying 3 Programmable sound Generators and various attributes.

Spkr it’s good to have more interest in QL Sounds. Some documentation on your Prog would help to explain your aims and its command handling.

Let the discussion continue…

QBITS
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spkr
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by spkr »

Cristian wrote:Before now, I thought I would never see a music tracker running on a real QL 8-)
It's very promising!
Some comments:
- it crashes with SuperGoldCard (not a problem for me)
- at least one note is out of tune (probably the FA)
- the cursor leaves blue squares on black background (not a real problem indeed)

Please go on with this innovative project. I offer my help, for the little that I am able to do
Thanks for the kind words, and the feedback its much appreciated!

With regards to the tones out of tune; the QL frequency tab is quite bad when mapping to actual notes. So the current keys are an APPROXIMATION to the best mapping QL has to offer....

With regards tot he supergoldcard; the software is targetted for black box ql, so the rest is... Well, both expected and unexpected :) ?

Im aware of the visual impediments it currently has. Im usually function over form, but noted!


spkr
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by spkr »

qbits wrote:If we are talking about Music trackers which act as music sequencer software for creating musical scores groups of notes. I have thought about extending the QBITS QLSounds BEEP and SCORE modes screen layout to include a more versatile Digital Synthesizer/MIDI Format editor.

Unfortunately, QL Beep Attributes I assume to the best of my knowledge generate a 16bit digital code and used with single transistor as a primitive form of Digital Analogue Conversion to energise the internal speaker. To create a digital coded output 24bit or 32Bit the latter better for MIDI recordings this will require a serial port outputting to a more versatile DAC device.

Note: Zpectrum Next has a Beep command but also enhanced sounds with a Play command deploying 3 Programmable sound Generators and various attributes.

Spkr it’s good to have more interest in QL Sounds. Some documentation on your Prog would help to explain your aims and its command handling.

Let the discussion continue…

QBITS
Hi QBITS

thank you for your kind words and feedback. I must say that some (all?!) of my code is based on your documentation combined with some testing around and whatnot. Thanks so much for meticulously describing your process, FUQL wouldnt have been developed as fast as if it werent for you!

The goal and aim for FUQL are simple. It is a tool primarily made for musician(s) to compose music to accompany democode that I want to release. As such, design choices are influenced by his/their feedback.

As for me, my goals are very much focused on what I want to achieve myself, and for FUQLTrack this does not involve documenting the tracker. In a sense, documentation would impose upkeep and drag for me; and Id rather just spend my time on developing.

However, I believe in free information and openness, and put the code to a public repository and have people find what they need from the codebase. And Im generally responsive to questions and/or chats on irc ;P

Kind regards,
Wietze


stevepoole
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by stevepoole »

Hi Wietz,
Perhaps you could define exacty what performance you expect to get from a QL music tracker?

The QL only has one speaker, so unless you use square-waves, you can only BEEP one double note at a time. (Square waves are rough on the ear).

If you are hoping for precise durations, graphical interfaces are impractical. So, better to use Data statements for input, especially for games use !

You can use any of my own code you wish, (See : fastStave6_bas.zip on this forum). Still undergoing slight development....

Good luck with your project : I will download your code tomorrow and take a close look at it.

Steve.
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spkr
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by spkr »

stevepoole wrote:Hi Wietz,
Perhaps you could define exacty what performance you expect to get from a QL music tracker?

The QL only has one speaker, so unless you use square-waves, you can only BEEP one double note at a time. (Square waves are rough on the ear).

If you are hoping for precise durations, graphical interfaces are impractical. So, better to use Data statements for input, especially for games use !

You can use any of my own code you wish, (See : fastStave6_bas.zip on this forum). Still undergoing slight development....

Good luck with your project : I will download your code tomorrow and take a close look at it.

Steve.
_____________________
Hi Steve,

Im not sure if we understand each other. The context of the tracker is to compose music (sounds?, on a stock machine) to go with demos. Within the demoscene we are very used to the actual chip sounds of oldschool machines :), so no worries there.

My tracker is just a tool to wrap around the QL sound capabilities. I am not expecting any kind of `sound quality' goal, apart from making all the stock sound capabilities the QL has accessible to the trackers user. As far as Im concerned, FUQL does exactly that (albeit the UI constraints the user slightly with regards to entering instrument notes into the pattern, but if need arises, this can be fixed).

As such, all the precise duration, instrument settings and stuff, equal to punching in data, is exactly possible with this. One can argue that in practice there are a few constriants, but basically these have not been considered a constraint ant thus not been solved.

Im afraid many democoder musicians (that I work with anyhow) find it impracticle to punch in data statements, hence the birth of FUQL.

Kind regards,
Wietze


qbits
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by qbits »

Hi Wietze
When I suggested more documentation, a note on the screen labels and what other keys cursors etc are used for interaction would be helpful.
I assume the top row uses the BEEP Attributes but what is OCTU for?
INST Instrument? 1 to 255
FREQ1 Pitch_1
FREQ2 Pitch_2
INTU Time Interval
DUR Duration
STEP Step Intervals
WRAP Wraps
RAND Randomness
FUZZ Fuzziness
OCTU ?

PATTERN each number I assume relates to the screen grid shown with 16 rows and 4 columns/Channels for different Notes/Instruments.
The screen column on the right 00 to OF are these Frames or possibly Amplitude Settings for each row?

For now, running your code on both of my emulators just freezes the screen! The Debugger ??? 000001D4: bsr.s pc+222 ; Src:$2B2 ???

Hi Steve
Would like to see the code for your FastStaves_bas can you provide link or re-post it

QBITS


spkr
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by spkr »

Hi qbits,

Octave is the Octave selection for the 2 active Octave from the keyboard interface.

The tab on the right is to sequence the patterns in succession. The active pattern can be changed by pressing the - and +, which alters the pattern under edit.
Pressing enter will play the sequence from start.

I found out that the code has some construct that works on the real machine, but not on all emulators or so. I will link an updated piece of code to see if that fixes your issue.

Regards
Wietze
Last edited by spkr on Wed Apr 27, 2022 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.


spkr
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by spkr »

attached the fixed version that prevents hanging on ZESarux.
Attachments
fuqltrack.zip
(12.38 KiB) Downloaded 63 times


stevepoole
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Re: are there music trackers for ql, and how sound works?

Post by stevepoole »

Hi Qbits,

Here is a recent version of the fastStave program I have been working on from time to time.

Perhaps its principal feature is to automatically ajust tempo to any system you run it on..... Such incompatibility used to be a big bug-bear,

Your Qbits program is much more neatly written. Mine combines two older programs, so much code is redundant.

I started writing the 'graphical interface' shortly before seeing your program, and don't have too much time to devote to improving it.

The main aim of fastStave is to SEE notes as you HEAR them, thereby training the ear to READ music as it plays....

Hope you find some of it useful.... Steve.
fastStave6_bas.zip
(9.64 KiB) Downloaded 70 times


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