Target for major new QL hardware

[daniel_baum]

I am not sure what you mean here, the WIN files or QWA container file is the same QWA file I use on QPC2 and SMSQmulator.

Hi Derek,

What I meant was that you can't just take an SD card containing a .WIN file from QPC or the Mister, and mount the file on the Q68. In the other direction (mounting a Q68 file on the other platform) this is possible, but it is still a limitation.

D.

Sorry, but I still do net see the problem.

The Q68 WIN files are located on a FAT32 partition, as far as I can see QPC2 can read FAT32, but Mister only uses FAT16 partitions. Which I find strange as it seems to be running Linux filesystems, which should handle anything.

Anyway, maybe time to buy a DE-10...

My Mister uses a 64GB SD card, and much bigger ones are usable, so it is not FAT-16.

The inconvenience, by which I do not mean "insurmountable problem" is that while the file format is the same, the Q68 has requirements for the position of the WIN file on the disk, it must not be segmented and its name has to be configured into the operating system. You can't just mount a random .WIN file on the fly like you can with the other systems.

As to HDMI, again, this is an _inconvenience_ rather than an insurmountable problem, which none of the other systems have.

The real insurmountable problem is the keyboard and mouse. You need an extra keyboard and mouse which take up desk space, and are also getting rather hard to find nowadays.

All of these together mean that my Q68 gets used less than the other options. I actually like it a lot, and only meant that if a future enhanced version overcame some of these inconveniences, it would fit into my system better than the current version. BTW, I do actually own a dedicated 17" 15khz VGA monitor, but my Atari ST is hogging it at the moment...

D.

[daniel_baum]

I am not sure what you mean here, the WIN files or QWA container file is the same QWA file I use on QPC2 and SMSQmulator.

Hi Derek,

What I meant was that you can't just take an SD card containing a .WIN file from QPC or the Mister, and mount the file on the Q68. In the other direction (mounting a Q68 file on the other platform) this is possible, but it is still a limitation.

D.

Now, that's not a fair claim to make. Exchange "Mister" and "Q68", and you get the same limitation. QPC2 and Q-Emulator can mount all possible FAT file system types (because their host OS can), MISTer can use FAT16 (does anyone still use that?), Q68 FAT32. Whether something works or not is up to you - You're formatting the SD card.

I don't get this - Mister is not limited to FAT-16.

D.

[tofro]

Hi Derek,

What I meant was that you can't just take an SD card containing a .WIN file from QPC or the Mister, and mount the file on the Q68. In the other direction (mounting a Q68 file on the other platform) this is possible, but it is still a limitation.

D.

Now, that's not a fair claim to make. Exchange "Mister" and "Q68", and you get the same limitation. QPC2 and Q-Emulator can mount all possible FAT file system types (because their host OS can), MISTer can use FAT16 (does anyone still use that?), Q68 FAT32. Whether something works or not is up to you - You're formatting the SD card.

I don't get his - Mister is not limited to FAT-16.

D.

Then there shouldn't be any problems exchanging containers with Q68 on FAT32?

[daniel_baum]

Now, that's not a fair claim to make. Exchange "Mister" and "Q68", and you get the same limitation. QPC2 and Q-Emulator can mount all possible FAT file system types (because their host OS can), MISTer can use FAT16 (does anyone still use that?), Q68 FAT32. Whether something works or not is up to you - You're formatting the SD card.

I don't get his - Mister is not limited to FAT-16.

D.

Then there shouldn't be any problems exchanging containers with Q68 on FAT32?

Here's where I see a potential problem - I have a .WIN file on my PC, used by e.g. QPC. I want to copy it to a Q68 SD card. Won't copying it over an existing file with the same name potentially cause segmentation, unless I format the SD card? If the answer to this is "no", then you're right, there is no problem.

D.

[Peter]

The real insurmountable problem is the keyboard and mouse. You need an extra keyboard and mouse which take up desk space, and are also getting rather hard to find nowadays.

This "insurmountable problem" has been solved with PS/2-USB converters, too. Surely not a cheap solution, but if someone is really eager, it can be done.

That PS/2 compatible mice or keyboards were already "hard to find" is just not true, as long as an Amazon search gives lots of results, and many of the latest PC mainboards still support PS/2.
Note that PS/2+USB combo devices are okay! You don't need pure PS/2 stuff for the Q68.

Here's where I see a potential problem - I have a .WIN file on my PC, used by e.g. QPC. I want to copy it to a Q68 SD card. Won't copying it over an existing file with the same name potentially cause segmentation, unless I format the SD card? If the answer to this is "no", then you're right, there is no problem.

The answer is no. As long as you don't change the container size.

[tofro]

I don't get his - Mister is not limited to FAT-16.

D.

Then there shouldn't be any problems exchanging containers with Q68 on FAT32?

Here's where I see a potential problem - I have a .WIN file on my PC, used by e.g. QPC. I want to copy it to a Q68 SD card. Won't copying it over an existing file with the same name potentially cause segmentation, unless I format the SD card? If the answer to this is "no", then you're right, there is no problem.

D.

As long as the file is the exact same size and name, you shouldn't have any problems.

I BTW never do this - Because all QL-alikes I have can look into the image file, I have them look in there (and copy from/to there natively), rather than exchanging the complete image.

If you want to be able to get rid of the "no segmentation" limitation, SMSQ/E for the Q68 would need to go through a complete file system layer (which it doesn't have) for FAT32 on any winx_ image access - That is simply not possible for a 68k CPU (even a fast one) without significant slowdown - MISTer can apparently do that because it has an ARM CPU to help out here (and the emulators obviously have an x86 CPU to help out).

[Andrew]

Here's where I see a potential problem - I have a .WIN file on my PC, used by e.g. QPC. I want to copy it to a Q68 SD card. Won't copying it over an existing file with the same name potentially cause segmentation, unless I format the SD card? If the answer to this is "no", then you're right, there is no problem.

D.

I do not own a Q68 but I own a QL-SD which has the same constraint: .WIN file must not be segmented
I ususally work on QPC and then copy the .WIN file over the one on the QL-SD and I never had any issues. (the files have the same name and exactly same size)
I usually use a 100Mb .WIN file on a 16Gb SD card - it takes a lot of copying until you have potential segmentation (you can fill in 160 separate contiguous .WIN files)
Rarely, from time to time I erase the SD card, or format it - it takes seconds.

But even this is a false problem, as long as you can take the SD card from you Q68/ QL-SD and insert it in the computer's card reader and set QPC to access it directly - then you do not need to copy it back at all !

[daniel_baum]

Thanks. I'll take another look at it. Maybe my Q68 can join the party after all.

D.

[Derek_Stewart]

Hi,

The SD Cards I send out with all new Q68 are 4Gb, with FST32: as partition 1 which holds the QWA container files and the SMSQ/E operating system, setup as WIN8

Partition 2 is a FAT16 Partition for data exchange.

To update the QWA container for WIN1, I put the SD Card in USB card reader on a Linux Laptop. I use SMSQmulator or QPC2 and mount the QWA container as WIN7 in the emulator.

I use QPAC2 FILES to copy any new software.

Put the SD Card into the Q68 and it boots up with new updated software.

The Q68 also reads QL-SD Qubide containers as well.

The SD Card from the Mister could put into the Q68 Card Slot 2 and the QWA container could be acessed, as long as the files are on the 1st partition.

With regards to the PS/2 question, I have some PS/2 to USB adapters, which seems to work with the Q68 PS/2 Splitter. This allows access to most USB keyboards and mice.

The catch is I only have a limited amount.

I have thought about trying copy them, but I guess there is copyright issues.

Anyway, I move this to a more appropriate thread.

[daniel_baum]

Anyway, I move this to a more appropriate thread.

Apologies for taking the thread off at a tangent - that was not my intention.

D.